Revolting Cocks remixed by Sherwood?

[Ras Berry]

Their Big Sexy Land album has been reissued and a couple of eBay sellers have cut and pasted some blurb from RevCo's Wiki page about a band fallout over a Sherwood remix of You Often Forget:


"Revolting Cocks’ origins date to late 1984, when Front 242 started their first American tour as an opening act for their then-label mates Ministry. Afterwards, Alain Jourgensen asked Richard 23 to join forces and produce a dub-remix project. After returning to Limited edition re-release on double vinyl with gatefold sleeve and expanded artwork including all original tracks plus the singles “No Devotion”, “You Often Forget” and another remix of “T.V. Mind”. Brussels, Richard proposed this collaboration to Luc Van Acker who decided to team the band just after talking with Al over the phone. “Big Sexy Land”, originally released through the legendary Wax Trax! Records in 1986, is the debut studio album by this supergroup featuring a mix of industrial, hard rock and EBM with dominating sampling and strong synthesized beats. It was composed mostly using a very expensive Fairlight CMI II synthesizer, sampler and work station that Al Jourgensen got funded by Sire Records. Luc Van Acker attributed album’s mixing to Jourgensen’s sessions with Adrian Sherwood on Ministry’s “Twitch”. Al surreptitiously took notes on Sherwood’s settings, but, without any context for the numbers, they had to later guess at what the settings were for, such as reverb and delay time. Album’s title is a reference to a strip club in West Berlin. Al Jourgensen said that club neon sign was “the biggest capitalistic tease” for citizens in East Germany. The idea to use Revolting Cocks came from an incident that took place in a Chicago bar. According to Luc and Al, they all was trying out “insulting French expressions” on a waiter, ordering something they said meant “revolting cock” which led the waiter to say, “You are revolting cocks!”. “Big Sexy Land” would be the only album made by the original incarnation as Richard 23 quit in 1986, after falling out with Jourgensen over an Adrian Sherwood’s remix of the song “You Often Forget”."


I don't remember hearing about this before - was it ever released?

[Charlie]

The "You Often Forget" 12" single was recorded and mixed at Southern in 1986, the same year as Twitch. There were two mixes on that, "Benign" and "Malignant". A comment I found here implies that it was included on that release, however there's no Sherwood credit.

"After the album was completed, Jourgensen and Adrian Sherwood (Twitch producer) did a remix of “You Often Forget”. Front-man Richard 23 (Front 242) hated the remix, and quit the band in a rage upon discovering that Wax Trax! had already released the new version as a single without consulting him."

Jethro seems to be the man for all the Al Jourgensen shenanigans. Perhaps he has more insight into this.

[Charlie]

Listen to these and see if you think Sherwood might be involved in one or the other:

Benign

Malignant

[Jethro]

Afraid nothing more from me here, I've not heard of a remix for it. I might make mention of it in the article and see if it stirs some comment. I could try asking in the Ministry group, but that's dangerous territory :)

[Jethro]

Those mixes sound like everything else of the era to my old ears :)

[Ras Berry]

Replies!

Thanks for the links, Charlie - my laptop wouldn't open them, but I'll snag a copy on the 'scogs in a day or two anyway...

[Jethro]

So the info above is essentially quoted out of the Luc Van Acker in the Ministry Gospels book. Here's how that question runs:

Q: Why did Richard 23 leave Revolting Cocks after Big Sexy Land?

LVA: Since Ministry was signed with Sire, Al wasn’t supposed to be in another band at first, so Revolting Cocks was just me and Richard, and Al was producing. But then Richard went home and Al came over to Belgium and then London to finish Big Sexy Land. After the album was done they had a disagreement about a track called “You Often Forget.” Al was working with Adrian Sherwood in London, and he did a dub remix, because Adrian was very good at dub mixing. Richard hated the dub mix. He thought it sounded like Mickey Mouse, but Wax Trax! had already released it as a twelve-inch. Richard was very upset that he didn’t have any say in the whole thing, so he quit.

To be honest I'd not really grokked that question!  It's immediately after it that the story with the stealing settings comes:


Q: It seems like Adrian Sherwood’s production style was hugely influential
for Al.


LVA: I was in London at Southern Studios when Al was mixing Ministry with Adrian Sherwood, and Al
would go to the toilet and copy down the studio settings Adrian used for his effects on toilet paper
and put them in his trousers. When we got back to the hotel Al would take all this toilet paper out of
his trousers and shout numbers at me, like “37, 43,” and I would take notes. But Al would not
remember what those numbers were for anymore. I still have this notebook full of the numbers of
Adrian’s settings. Al was an absolute big fan of Adrian Sherwood, and they were really good friends.
  But of course Adrian Sherwood was not so happy Al started to use all his tricks.

I actually asked LVA about this. He replied:

Hahaha it was written with a Sharpy on toilet paper... because we had no phones... Toiletpaper was fluched

I then asked specifically about the notebooks mentioned, and he said:

Now I remember I did write it down for Al in a notebook but that was his. So you have to ask him.

But yes there is no evidence that the versions on that WaxTrax 12" are Adrian's, and it's not obvious from listening.  So ... ?

[Jethro]

No further help from the press sheet accompanying this copy: www.discogs.com/Revolting-Cocks-You-Often-Forget/release/3612925

[Jethro]

Let's see if LVA entertains another geeky annoying question from me ...

[Ras Berry]

Now that I've looked up an actual copy of the 12", the cover and the gurning bloke are eerily familiar... I wonder if I've had a copy in the past or even have one now tucked away somewhere (although my filing system isn't that bad, so probably not), or if it was just one of those records that you used to see all over the place 'back in the day'?

[Jethro]

Here's LVA's reply:

Adrian never did any Revco mixes. Only Al. The dispute was with Jim and Al... Jim because the 12" was already released. In those days it could take up to 3 or 4 weeks to send a cassete tape. R23 was not at ease with the Revco crazy and his Front 242 serious. His high pitch mickey mouse voice bothered him as his approval had been bypassed.


So LVA was wrong in the book :)

I will write a new paragraph for the article.

[Charlie]

Thanks for clearing that up Jethro. I got excited there for a minute .

[Ras Berry]

I got that excited that I bought the record! There goes a tenner...

Having now heard the tunes on Charlie's links it does sound like a slightly weaker version of Sherwood's techniques. Obviously the Sharpie-on-bogroll settings weren't quite right